1st FAI Virtual WGC announced

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Vertigo
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Re: 1st FAI Virtual WGC announced

Post by Vertigo » Fri Jan 10, 2025 4:07 pm

timbaeyens wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2025 3:41 pm

You would be surprised to see this then:
Yep. Very much. Though it also appears that game/sim had over 1 million online competitors.
Shows what I know I guess.

havet865
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Re: 1st FAI Virtual WGC announced

Post by havet865 » Fri Jan 10, 2025 4:31 pm

Vertigo wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2025 4:07 pm
timbaeyens wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2025 3:41 pm

You would be surprised to see this then:
Yep. Very much. Though it also appears that game/sim had over 1 million online competitors.
Shows what I know I guess.
You would be surprised to learn how much people play Condor.
You would not be surprised that this number and a lot of numbers have been requested by the IOC.

We are probably much more than what you think :mrgreen:

havet865
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Re: 1st FAI Virtual WGC announced

Post by havet865 » Fri Jan 10, 2025 4:49 pm

Always happy to remind the community that Gliding was an Olympic sport back in 1936-1940, if you didn't know: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gliding_a ... r_Olympics

It might be time for a come back, or should we wait a century for that?

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EDB
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Re: 1st FAI Virtual WGC announced

Post by EDB » Fri Jan 10, 2025 6:18 pm

havet865 wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2025 4:49 pm
Always happy to remind the community that Gliding was an Olympic sport back in 1936-1940.

No, it wasn't.

In 1936 it was a demonstration to the International Olympic Committee (IOC). No contest took place and no prizes were allowed by the IOC.

And guess why it was a demo in Germany in 1936? Why the sport 'exploded' after 1933 in Germany? Massively supported/promoted by the regime. When Germany wasn't allowed to have an airforce (but still did build one and needed many pilots) after what happened between 1914 and 1918. I would keep this info in the archives. It wasn't very positive. Not something to be proud of. Even second, third and fourth generation Germans feel still guilty. Don't keep reminding them. They now are the victims. We need a United EU and NATO.
Gliding appears on the preliminary program of the 1940 Olympics to be held in Helsinki, but the outbreak of the Winter War in 1939 and World War II in 1939-1940 meant these Olympics were never held. The sport remained on the list of optional sports through 1956, when the IOC decided to abolish that list.


Personally I think that after the second WW, the IOC felt they were abused by the German regime. Not only the gliding demo, but the 1936 games in general. They let gliding on the (demo) list because they didn't know what to do with it and only in 1956 removed it from the list, hoping no one would notice... Hoping no one would link the 1956 removal with the 1936 games. If it was on the (pre) list of 1940, why not after the second WW?

If I was communicating with the IOC, I wouldn't remind them... They might find gliding on a blacklist with sports that didn't make it into the Olympics and never will. No matter for what ever reason.

havet865
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Re: 1st FAI Virtual WGC announced

Post by havet865 » Sat Jan 11, 2025 12:14 pm

EDB wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2025 6:18 pm
havet865 wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2025 4:49 pm
Always happy to remind the community that Gliding was an Olympic sport back in 1936-1940.

No, it wasn't.

In 1936 it was a demonstration to the International Olympic Committee (IOC). No contest took place and no prizes were allowed by the IOC.

And guess why it was a demo in Germany in 1936? Why the sport 'exploded' after 1933 in Germany? Massively supported/promoted by the regime. When Germany wasn't allowed to have an airforce (but still did build one and needed many pilots) after what happened between 1914 and 1918. I would keep this info in the archives. It wasn't very positive. Not something to be proud of. Even second, third and fourth generation Germans feel still guilty. Don't keep reminding them. They now are the victims. We need a United EU and NATO.
Gliding appears on the preliminary program of the 1940 Olympics to be held in Helsinki, but the outbreak of the Winter War in 1939 and World War II in 1939-1940 meant these Olympics were never held. The sport remained on the list of optional sports through 1956, when the IOC decided to abolish that list.


Personally I think that after the second WW, the IOC felt they were abused by the German regime. Not only the gliding demo, but the 1936 games in general. They let gliding on the (demo) list because they didn't know what to do with it and only in 1956 removed it from the list, hoping no one would notice... Hoping no one would link the 1956 removal with the 1936 games. If it was on the (pre) list of 1940, why not after the second WW?

If I was communicating with the IOC, I wouldn't remind them... They might find gliding on a blacklist with sports that didn't make it into the Olympics and never will. No matter for what ever reason.

I see your point, Erwin, but I must respectfully disagree with your perspective on gliding's potential inclusion in the Olympics based on its historical association. I understand the concerns you raise about its past, especially in the context of 1936 Germany. I think that a lot of people are aware of the Versailles Treaty and why gliding was so popular in the 30's, but not a lot of people are aware that gliding has been once a demonstration sport, and almost an Olympic Sport. Sharing the wikipedia link above was enough for people to understand what happened. Let's not forget as well that gliders were used by the allies in Normandy back in June 1944... was that wrong?

However, I believe that if we were to judge sports solely by their historical origins or associations, we would severely limit the progression and inclusivity of sports in the modern era.

The Olympic Games themselves have a complex history. Initially, the ancient Olympics were more about religious festivals and showcasing physical prowess among Greek city-states, often with political (and geopolitical) undertones. It was still the case with your example in 1930, and it was again correct in 2024 at the Paris Olympics: organizers do select sports where they have more chances to win medals. It's all about politics. Fast forward to the modern era, the games have evolved significantly in terms of values, inclusivity, and the spirit of sportsmanship. And the Olympic Esports Games is a huge opportunity for the sport.

Now, let's consider other sports:

- Archery was historically used in warfare, yet it's now revered for its precision, discipline, and cultural significance in the Olympics. (I was amazed by the performances at the Paris Olympics on the Invalides place - I was lucky enough to see the finals).

- Judo and other Martial Arts like Karate or Taekwondo have roots in combat training but are celebrated for their philosophy of respect, self-improvement, and peace.

- Marathon running stems from a legendary tale of military dispatch but has become an emblem of endurance, determination, and global participation.

- Swimming, once a survival skill, now promotes health, inclusivity, and is one of the most watched sports in the Olympics. (Léon Marchand :mrgreen: )

I took those 4 examples to show you that sports evolve, but there are dozens of sports like this. Their current practice, values, and the community around them have transformed to fit modern Olympic ideals like friendship, respect, and excellence. I keep in mind the smile of this young Chinese lady next to two Italians on the podium last summer, who was so happy and proud to be on the podium.

Regarding gliding, even if there was a controversial past, the sport today, especially in forms like Virtual Gliding or Sailplane Grand Prix, aligns with IOC values of promoting technology, accessibility, environmental consciousness, and global sportsmanship. Virtual Gliding respects all IOC values by offering a platform where pilots from around the world can compete without the need for physical travel, reducing carbon footprints, and increasing participation from diverse backgrounds.

My point is, sports should be judged by their current values, contribution to society, and alignment with the Olympic spirit rather than by historical baggage. The IOC has shown in the past its ability to adapt and include sports that reflect contemporary values and technological advancements.

So, while I understand your reservations, I believe that sports, including gliding, should be given the chance to prove themselves in their modern form, just as many other sports have done over time. Hence my last sentence: "It might be time for a come back, or should we wait a century for that?"

Have a very good weekend all,
Antoine

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