Anyone tried Rift-S?

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smithcorp
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Anyone tried Rift-S?

Post by smithcorp » Thu May 23, 2019 9:38 am

I'm reading it has substantially better resolution (reading gauges etc) than Oculus Rift CV1
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Bluejet
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Re: Anyone tried Rift-S?

Post by Bluejet » Thu May 23, 2019 11:26 pm

I made my first flights last night with the Rift S and am an instant convert to VR. VR completely changes the Condor2 experience and I won't go back.

I haven't tried the earlier VR versions, so I have nothing to compare it with.

First Impressions:

1. Intruments are blurry until I lean forward. This really needs to be addressed and is an old issue from what I've read.

2. 3D effect was amazing and I easily perceived when I was descending in the mountains better. At one point, I "felt" like I was descending in sink.

3. Glasses - I wear progressive lenses for near and far vision. I tried several pairs of glasses, inlcuding single vision lenses, and didn't have any luck improving the sharpness of the instruments. I read that the focal length is 51", so I will get a new prescription and try some cheap lenses.

4. Screen door effect is there, but not a factor once in the air.

5. Setup was easy. ESC to bring up menu to end flight shows up in headset, but not on the mirrored screen for some reason. I was trying to talk my son through it, but only he could see it and I couldn't use the mouse. We really would like to see keyboard commands to end a flight.

6. VR vertigo - cleared up after about thirty minutes and didn't come back on the next flight.

7. Being new to VR, I was led to believe by the marketing that the resolution would be better than what I'm seeing. I'm using a new RTX 2070 graphics card, but may not be properly set up to get the best quality just yet. I opted for the Rift S vs Quest because the reviews said the PC connection would have better graphics with a good video card. In a nutshell, I was expecting the graphics to be closer to my screen resolution on my old 60hZ Samsung monitor.

8. The inside-out sensors are amazing and worth every penny to not have to set up sensors. This is the future.

9. You can't turn off the hand units when just using the headset, so batteries may suffer.

Paul Agnew
Jupiter, FL
Last edited by Bluejet on Thu May 23, 2019 11:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Bluejet
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Re: Anyone tried Rift-S?

Post by Bluejet » Thu May 23, 2019 11:29 pm

Funny first sensation - cognitive disconnect seeing my legs up while sitting upright in an office chair. I really needed to raise my feet and lean back in the seat to get my proprioception aligned with the Condor pilot image.

I think a simple simpit is in my future.

PA

cvvs
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Re: Anyone tried Rift-S?

Post by cvvs » Fri May 24, 2019 3:24 am

actually when we have VR glasses, we do not want to come back to the screen, so I was a little further and I made myself a cockpit

https://www.dropbox.com/s/sireghhv8j4c5 ... 2.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/410fzof45j38f ... 4.jpg?dl=0

DanP
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Re: Anyone tried Rift-S?

Post by DanP » Fri May 24, 2019 10:25 am

That stick stand seems to be rather high, can you hold it comfortably i.e. with your hand resting on your leg? Also, how does the VR google work in reference to your surrounding, any way to look out under it to see the keyboard for additional stick buttons, example?

Lensman
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Re: Anyone tried Rift-S?

Post by Lensman » Sat May 25, 2019 4:57 pm

Just upgraded from a Rift CV1 to the Rift S.
The difference in clarity is remarkable. The instrument panels are all clearly readable without having to lean in. I can notice fine detail in the tow plane, clearly seeing the detail of the pilot model. Distant landscape features are a marked improvement and there is a boost in brightness and colour saturation. You really have to look hard for the 'screen door' effect now and it's only visible for me if I hold my vision stationary on an even toned part of the image.
I haven't changed my graphics settings from the CV1 - all graphics on high and pixel density at 1.5 (via the Oculus tray tool)
Frame rate is pegged at 80fps
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Al_B
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Re: Anyone tried Rift-S?

Post by Al_B » Sat May 25, 2019 5:19 pm

Son got his Rift S couple days ago.

Pro's:
I am really liking the improved clarity over CV1, the head strap system is a better design, the face shield seems more form fitting and comfortable for me, with improvements in padding and around the nose. They have widened the unit so it is much easier to fit over rx glasses. It has awesome tracking without the external sensors so long as you dont get your hands right up in front of the cameras. Also the black and white pass through feature is handy, allowing you to see the outside world without taking off the Rift, avoid obstacles, pick up coffee mug, find mouse, etc, (although the clarity of pass through does not allow you to read text). I did not notice a difference between the 90 hz CV1 and 80hz on the S.

Cons:
I found the headset is more balanced further forward than CV1, have not tried it for lengthy periods but might be an issue? Sound... It's nice not having the CV1 ear piece on the ears, however the audio is not nearly as good as CV1, more muted bass and volume. The S does have a 3.5mm headphone jack, so you could use your own audio earbuds/headphones. The built in speakers are also positioned above your ears so the position of sound is biased slightly above. The audio is not so much pumped into your ears, it is directed in your general direction but also sent out into the room and is audible to anyone close by. Imo 3.5mm in ear buds with wire secured to headset is the way to go.
Last edited by Al_B on Sat May 25, 2019 5:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Gravity never loses. The best you can hope for is a draw.

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Al_B
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Re: Anyone tried Rift-S?

Post by Al_B » Sat May 25, 2019 5:22 pm

cvvs wrote:
Fri May 24, 2019 3:24 am
"actually when we have VR glasses, we do not want to come back to the screen, so I was a little further and I made myself a cockpit"

Hi CVS,

Looks like a great design for sailplanes! Looks sturdy, ergonomic seating, and appears to be made to disassemble? Is this design your own or did you find plans?

Does the stick mount lower? It seems way too high...

Aside from the stick mount, and lack of side tables to allow mouse/drink etc. it looks awesome! Couple suggestions: I would add folding side tables/shelves for mouse etc. Also could incorporate a keyboard mount in front of a lowered joystick mount.

Nice job!!
Last edited by Al_B on Sun May 26, 2019 2:20 am, edited 2 times in total.
Gravity never loses. The best you can hope for is a draw.

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Bluejet
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Re: Anyone tried Rift-S?

Post by Bluejet » Sun May 26, 2019 12:31 am

Thanks for the tip on the Oculus Tray tool. I'll give it a look.

Do Condor2 video settings affect Oculus or are they bypassed by the Oculus software/drivers? I have mine set for 8x and sync, but don't see a difference. It sounds like the pixel setting in the Oculus debugging tool (via Oculus Tray tool) is what makes the difference.

Paul A.

sin
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Re: Anyone tried Rift-S?

Post by sin » Mon May 27, 2019 2:29 am

cvvs wrote:
Fri May 24, 2019 3:24 am
actually when we have VR glasses, we do not want to come back to the screen, so I was a little further and I made myself a cockpit

https://www.dropbox.com/s/sireghhv8j4c5 ... 2.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/410fzof45j38f ... 4.jpg?dl=0
Can you give your cockpit drawings for assembly?
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Mas
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Re: Anyone tried Rift-S?

Post by Mas » Mon May 27, 2019 3:16 pm

Bluejet wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 11:29 pm
Funny first sensation - cognitive disconnect seeing my legs up while sitting upright in an office chair. I really needed to raise my feet and lean back in the seat to get my proprioception aligned with the Condor pilot image.

I think a simple simpit is in my future.

PA
Hi , have you tried adjusting your cockpit scale yet . You can adjust in main menu settings with a slider , but also in real time when you are flying and a HUD will show you your setting ( can't remember key combinations , anybody )This can really alleviate the feeling that the body you see is not your own . Most pilots report that first views in VR the cockpit looks a little small and hips and projecting legs for me seemed to come out of my belly . With the IPD adjust at 0.93X everything looks great - hips seem to match my own and cockpit looks about right size . It really also prevents me feeling nausea from mismatch size between what I see and what I feel ( body dis-morphia ) I tried flying in a reclining deck chair and it helps too .<br/>
<br/>
Regards resolution if you set MSAA to max in Condor and use 1.5X Super sampling in Oculus Tray Tool you will have no trouble to read gauges providing you have your Rift adjusted properly on your head .<br/>

Mas
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Re: Anyone tried Rift-S?

Post by Mas » Mon May 27, 2019 3:23 pm

Bluejet wrote:
Sun May 26, 2019 12:31 am
Thanks for the tip on the Oculus Tray tool. I'll give it a look.

Do Condor2 video settings affect Oculus or are they bypassed by the Oculus software/drivers? I have mine set for 8x and sync, but don't see a difference. It sounds like the pixel setting in the Oculus debugging tool (via Oculus Tray tool) is what makes the difference.

Paul A.
No they don't - you must make the settings inside Oculus .the MSAA ( ? ) inside Condor 2 video settings alone makes a clear difference with readability of instruments , but Super sampling in OTT has the most powerful effect on sharpness. There is also significant variation in for example the ASI size depending on the glider . I believe that the new screens of Rift S having higher resolution than CV1 and more subpixels and less SDE responds particularly well to S/S. I'm intending to order a Rift S to replace my CV1 soon once i recover from buying a Quest :)

Mas
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Re: Anyone tried Rift-S?

Post by Mas » Mon May 27, 2019 4:22 pm

Bluejet wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 11:26 pm

7. Being new to VR, I was led to believe by the marketing that the resolution would be better than what I'm seeing. I'm using a new RTX 2070 graphics card, but may not be properly set up to get the best quality just yet. I opted for the Rift S vs Quest because the reviews said the PC connection would have better graphics with a good video card. In a nutshell, I was expecting the graphics to be closer to my screen resolution on my old 60hZ Samsung monitor.
FYI I think your anticipation of the perceived resolution was more about your focus on the advertised resolution . I've never personally seen any VR HMD advertising that compares perceived VR HMD resolution to monitor resolution . They may use terms like HD optics etc but that is just advertisong hyperbole . In the HMD for the same nominal pixel resolution or number you have around 3 X less pixels per angular degree in VR . The HMD actually has to use even more screen area to render an image that is software warped to counteract the optical warping of the simple fresnel lenses.

The screen is then effectively so close to your face that it fills 100 degrees view rather than the 45 degree of apparent angle of your desktop screen . I saw a figure somewhere that to achieve `retina ' display level in VR ( ie where you can't see any pixels at all ) we will need around 16 mpix screens . The only just superseded screens in Rift were only around 1.2mpix so you can see just how far we have to go . The latest Rift S - users are comparing them similar to 720p screens on a desktop monitor ( despite the native per eye resolution of around 1280 X 144o pixels ) . yes we could go further into foveated rendering and eye tracking technology on the way which will make such high Mpix screens possible to use with current GPU's but that is a whole other story .

Mas
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Re: Anyone tried Rift-S?

Post by Mas » Mon May 27, 2019 4:24 pm

Mas wrote:
Mon May 27, 2019 4:22 pm
Bluejet wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 11:26 pm

7. Being new to VR, I was led to believe by the marketing that the resolution would be better than what I'm seeing. I'm using a new RTX 2070 graphics card, but may not be properly set up to get the best quality just yet. I opted for the Rift S vs Quest because the reviews said the PC connection would have better graphics with a good video card. In a nutshell, I was expecting the graphics to be closer to my screen resolution on my old 60hZ Samsung monitor.
FYI I think your anticipation of the perceived resolution was more about your focus on the advertised resolution . I've never personally seen any VR HMD advertising that compares perceived VR HMD resolution to monitor resolution . They may use terms like HD optics etc but that is just advertisong hyperbole . In the HMD for the same nominal pixel resolution or number you have around 3 X less pixels per angular degree in VR . The HMD actually has to use even more screen area to render an image that is software warped to counteract the optical warping of the simple fresnel lenses.

The screen is then effectively so close to your face that it fills 100 degrees view rather than the 45 degree of apparent angle of your desktop screen . I saw a figure somewhere that to achieve `retina ' display level in VR ( ie where you can't see any pixels at all ) we will need around 16 mpix screens . The only just superseded screens in Rift were only around 1.2mpix so you can see just how far we have to go . The latest Rift S - users are comparing them similar to 720p screens on a desktop monitor ( despite the native per eye resolution of around 1280 X 144o pixels ) . yes we could go further into foveated rendering and eye tracking technology on the way which will make such high Mpix screens possible to use with current GPU's but that is a whole other story .

Hope this all helps to curb your disappointment about the resolution ! My first foray into Condor VR was with an Emagin Z800 in 2005 , which had a native resolution per eye of 800 X 600 pixels ....it was 3D , had very crude head tracking but it was great !

cvvs
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Re: Anyone tried Rift-S?

Post by cvvs » Wed May 29, 2019 3:30 am

for the plans I opened a new topic in cockpit builder : viewtopic.php?f=14&t=19005#p164256

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