Buying used Microsoft Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 (msff2)

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philster57
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Buying used Microsoft Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 (msff2)

Post by philster57 » Fri Apr 05, 2019 2:44 am

Hi,
I've read through numerous posts about the subject joystick and it is clear that the Microsoft Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 (msff2) is a very popular and highly recommended joystick for Condor. Since it is longer being manufactured, it must be purchased used, typically from eBay.

I have a few questions before I send someone $ for one.
1) They often don't come with the power cord. Is the power cord fairly standard and therefore easy to find?
2) The sellers often state that they are tested. This means that basic joystick functions work. However they rarely know whether or not the the force feedback works. So, are these joysticks fairly reliable, such that if the basic joystick functions work, one can assume that the FF works?


FYI - Info on this joystick and other's from the family.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft ... edback_Pro

Thanks,
Phil

sisu1a
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Re: Buying used Microsoft Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 (msff2)

Post by sisu1a » Fri Apr 05, 2019 4:58 am

Power cord is a standard IEC C7 type, non polar

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I've bought some on ebay recently and they were in great shape, better than the one I already had. I'd be suspect of any that don't have a cord though, as it can't be tested. Most I've seen have the cord and are listed as being fully functional... it's worth being a little bit picky and ignoring any listed as 'non tested'.

They do break down eventually, and they are also prone to mechanical wear in the gears that make them feel sloppy so stick with sellers that stand behind their gear and spend the extra few bucks

janjansen
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Re: Buying used Microsoft Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 (msff2)

Post by janjansen » Fri Apr 05, 2019 9:19 am

My brother and I hoard these sticks, between us we have bought 6 or so now? Maybe more. (Several have been given away, at least one was used to replace a stick I spilled beer on, the rest sits on shelves unused) In my experience they are extremely reliable. The most common issue is the buttons on the base which become flaky. Some electrical cleaner spray can help there, but doesnt fully solve the problem. I cant say I notice a difference in mechanical slop, the sensors are optical and while the motor gearing is plastic (or rather nylon I think?) the gears are huge and fine toothed, so even if some slop develops there, it would probably be tough to notice in a glider.

Note we bought all our sticks for around 25 euro a piece, not from ebay but a local second hand site. Its fair to assume anyone selling these sticks for that price do no know what they are selling, and therefore are not simulation addicts who used these sticks 6 hours per day. These sticks generally looked brand new. One exception is the red button, second edition (red trigger, silver base buttons). These have a rubberized grip, and that rubber finish can degrade and become tacky. At least that what I read, and have seen on the one I spilled beer on and that I later stored in a unheated shed.
I would avoid those if you can.

philster57
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Re: Buying used Microsoft Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 (msff2)

Post by philster57 » Sat Apr 20, 2019 5:44 am

Thanks for the info folks! Very helpful. Working on acquiring one.

MrHerisson
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Re: Buying used Microsoft Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 (msff2)

Post by MrHerisson » Mon Apr 29, 2019 12:20 pm

Do they come with proper modern connexions (ie usb).
Most i saw were fitted with that old connexion thing with lots of little pins and screws to hold it in place....
I don't want to buy some adapter.
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Bre901
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Re: Buying used Microsoft Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 (msff2)

Post by Bre901 » Mon Apr 29, 2019 12:24 pm

The Force Feedback 2 comes with an USB cable

The ones with an RS-232 cable are version 1 and should be avoided.
CN: MPT — CondorUTill webpage: https://condorutill.fr/

janjansen
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Re: Buying used Microsoft Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 (msff2)

Post by janjansen » Mon Apr 29, 2019 1:08 pm

What Marc said. Maybe this picture helps.

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Most left and most right are FFB2s, they have USB and are recommended. The inner ones are the FFB1 with gameport connection and should be avoided. Easiest way is to look at the throttle, the 2 has a silver one with a very different shape, or the look at the layout of the buttons on the stick.

MrHerisson
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Re: Buying used Microsoft Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 (msff2)

Post by MrHerisson » Mon Apr 29, 2019 2:16 pm

Thanks a lot
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philster57
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Re: Buying used Microsoft Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 (msff2)

Post by philster57 » Tue May 07, 2019 5:38 pm

Just an update. I acquired one from eBay. :) The seller stated that it was tested. While I didn't get confirmation from the seller that the force feedback had be specifically tested I felt pretty confident that it should be fine based on info janjansen provided and seller's history. It was pretty simple to set it up and confirm that it was working.

At this point, I'd say that force feedback is a nice to have feature but far from essential.

Update: after many months of usage I would now say that it is noticeably better than a regular joystick. Only drawbacks are that occasionally the FFB stops working and only a Windows reboot will fix it. If you alt-tab to another window you may lose FFB but can usually recover by left click in the Condor window after you have alt-tabbed back to it. A few more buttons would be nice.

philster57
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Re: Buying used Microsoft Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 (msff2)

Post by philster57 » Tue May 19, 2020 10:50 pm

In addition to the photos in a previous post, the part No. that are good are:  X05-92622   or  X05-73776  as found on the sticker on the bottom in the middle.  That sticker will be black or white.  The Electric shock hazard sticker on the side on the bottom will have orange or white where Warning  Precaucion  Attention is written.  The folks on eBay selling these will often have photos of the bottom or at least list the part numbers in their ad. One of mine came in the original blue box. On that box the part No was X05-64248

Note that you may not get a power cord and most sellers do not have the means to test the FFB and/or do not know how to test it. But so far I have purchased 4 and they have all worked. According to others, these are pretty reliable.

jsmiley
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Re: Buying used Microsoft Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 (msff2)

Post by jsmiley » Thu May 21, 2020 12:23 am

Be aware that force feed back only works when the sensor on the lip (bottom front) is covered by your hand.
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solidxsnake
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Re: Buying used Microsoft Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 (msff2)

Post by solidxsnake » Tue Jun 02, 2020 12:59 am

jsmiley wrote:
Thu May 21, 2020 12:23 am
Be aware that force feed back only works when the sensor on the lip (bottom front) is covered by your hand.
Very useful tip, thanks! I just taped a piece of paper over the sensor to force the FFB to be on (since I try and hold the stick as I would in a real glider with just my fingertips, so not necessarily covering the sensor all the time). See the photos below:

Image

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Bluejet
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Re: Buying used Microsoft Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 (msff2)

Post by Bluejet » Sun Aug 23, 2020 11:11 pm

One more tidbit. There are actually two sensors and only one needs to be covered. Look under the top lip of the grip and you'll see another little hole. A piece of thape there doesn't get pushed off with use as often for me since I rest my hand on the bottom of the grip.

Your mileage may vary...

Paul

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