Triple Monitor support?

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Jetsailplane
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Triple Monitor support?

Post by Jetsailplane » Sun Feb 25, 2018 3:26 pm

Users, I am excited to dive into the world of 2.0. I’m video card shopping and wondering how I could set it up for three monitors for a triple sized natural field of view. I’m not a track IR fan. I would love to have 3 24” 4K monitors to fly from. Would I need three video cards? What is the best value video card to max out the Condor 2.0 experience? Thanks for your help?
Hawes

Jetsailplane
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Re: Triple Monitor support?

Post by Jetsailplane » Sun Feb 25, 2018 3:50 pm

Another option I am considering is 2 34” ultrawide curved monitors. This would put a seam down the middle but the natural curve of the monitors might ad a more natural field of view. I’m looking at a $480 monitor on amazon. All this until we get VR support and then multiple monitors won’t matter.

janjansen
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Re: Triple Monitor support?

Post by janjansen » Sun Feb 25, 2018 4:04 pm

You dont need three videocards. Most gaming cards will let you attach 3 monitors. But not all monitor outputs may support 4K at decent rates. So look for one with 3 display port outputs.

But 2 caveats:
- Condor renders only 1 viewport. That means that the side screens get distorted and stretched horizontally. This is particularly bad if you intended to angle the monitors around you and use a wide FoV. FWIW, I have a triple monitor setup, but I dont use it for condor. I use only 1 (UWD) monitor and track ir.
- 3x4K monitors is a lot of pixels. Really a lot. Condor has modest hardware requirements, but with that many pixels, you'll need a serious videocard. And Im not even 100% sure it will work.

2 ultrawides will have almost the same distortion problem and the bezel in the middle is really going to ruin the immersion. I would advise against that.

janjansen
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Re: Triple Monitor support?

Post by janjansen » Sun Feb 25, 2018 4:13 pm

To give you an idea, this is on my setup with UWD in the middle and 2xHD:

Image

Without trackir, or when looking ahead thats not too bad. But when you start panning its a different story:

Image

dins
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Re: Triple Monitor support?

Post by dins » Tue Jun 05, 2018 10:26 am

Several caveats
Many graphics cards may have three physical output ports, but in my experience the vast majority only support two outputs simultaneously.
second, many cards are derived from the makers chipset but dont necessarily provide all the capabilities of that chipset

having been burned in that area, I decided on a no risk Matrox Triplehead to go device, which appears to the computers graphics card as one very wide monitor. (The Triple head then splits the signals into three outputs- the model I chose had both VGA and DVI inputs and could output in both, so a) I had lots of flexibility of projectors b) futureproof c) worked straight out of the box, did not even need to load drivers

yes there may be other approaches, we used projectors and big screens to give a feeling of immersion, Current issue of UK Sailplane and Gliding (and next one, I hope) has all the details

janjansen
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Re: Triple Monitor support?

Post by janjansen » Tue Jun 05, 2018 1:38 pm

dins wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 10:26 am
Several caveats
Many graphics cards may have three physical output ports, but in my experience the vast majority only support two outputs simultaneously.
That hasnt been true for 5 if not 10 years, and afaik used to be a problem only when mixing analog and digital signals. Anything you buy today will be able to drive 3+ monitors over hdmi and/or DP. If you have a single display port connector, you're good to go, you can daisy chain.
having been burned in that area, I decided on a no risk Matrox Triplehead to go device,
Thats a shame. Those devices are needlessly expensive, and whats worse, you now cant use the brand new multimonitor feature introduced in condor 2.0.3, which lets you configure individual camera perspectives for each monitor, solving the very problem I explained above. Instead you'll have this stretched, deformed pixel blur on your outer edges, which was the reason I resisted using my triple monitors for condor until now. That new feature still needs some work, see my post on the topic here (viewtopic.php?f=29&t=18188), but the correct perspective makes an enormous difference, and I enjoy using it in combination with a trackir.

For reference, this is how it was before MM feature:

Image

Notice how the instruments are not exactly round anymore, as everything on the outer screens is warped.

And this is now:

Image

The seam you see between the middle and right monitor, is only on the screenshot. I have no idea why, but like I said, that feature needs some work, but devs already said they are working on fixing those issues.

dins
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Re: Triple Monitor support?

Post by dins » Tue Jun 05, 2018 4:49 pm

Always happy to be educated, but even checking the market last year there were many video cards with more physical ports than could be driven simultaneously... And there aint main projectors with Display port inputs.. if you can recommend a video card which either drive three HDMI (/DVI) or know of a good Display Port to three HDMI splitter ie to sthat each display has its own FOV, please let me know.

My decisions were based on a conservative approach to get capability without wasting or busting a limited club budget, and long before we knew MM support was going to be part of the C2 deal.

Cheers

David

janjansen
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Re: Triple Monitor support?

Post by janjansen » Tue Jun 05, 2018 5:11 pm

DVI can be digital (DVI-D) or analog (DVI-A). The connector supports both, but your videocard and/or your projector may not. As I mentioned, most videocards have limits on the number of analog displays, because they dont have DACs for every port. And your projector may be analog only and not support DVI-D. DVI-A really is VGA signal over a different connector. When using digital connections (DVI-D, HDMI, DP,..) you shouldnt have any problems on the videocard side. I have used triple (digital) monitors with a variety of videocards over the years, and never had an issue.

Your problem is more likely on the projector side. I assume you dont want to replace them, can you find out what type they are, and exactly which inputs they support?

dins
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Re: Triple Monitor support?

Post by dins » Thu Jun 07, 2018 3:11 pm

This started about 2 years ago and being a club, funds were limited and we went down the "discarded" analog VGA input path, The triple head model has DVI and VGA inputs DVI (with Analog output pins active also), so I can almost "plug and play" projectors.

Triple head worked very well using VGA or DVI inputs,

Bought two Optomax H114 projectors with HDMI and VGA inputs, I know DVI & HDMI are similar signals with different connectors, HDMI from Triplehead to projector, remaining analog projector via DVI to Analog physical adapter, and long VGA cable

Digital video to front & left, anlaog to right.

Donated PC is low profile desktop. Detail is currently great with Scotland 3 scenery which is almost photographic when above 500 feet AGL,, (poor below)

Advice I need is how to find a new (low profile) video card which will drive three projectors (I have ordered a third H114) each via HDMI, but have not found one (yet) , nor an adapter/splitter to "spread" the picture-
Aim would be primarily to reduce distortion by using C2.0.3 multiscreen and/or to increase lateral FOV with a tolerable distortion... (primarily for teaching circuits) Open to advice but should be proven solutions

Thanks
DI

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wickid
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Re: Triple Monitor support?

Post by wickid » Thu Jun 07, 2018 3:28 pm

I use an AMD Radeon Eyefinity 6 card. There is a version with 6 miniDP outputs which runs condor just fine. The first 3 are used to drive a 190 degree visual with 3 Benq short trow beamers on a curved projection wall. We use MiniDP to HDMI cables. 2 outputs are used to drive small screens behind the instrument panels. These have active miniDP to VGA connectors. We searched for HDMI capable screens but could only find VGA screens that were small enough to fit in the original ASK21 instrument panels.
Last edited by wickid on Thu Jun 07, 2018 8:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
PH-1504, KOE
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janjansen
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Re: Triple Monitor support?

Post by janjansen » Thu Jun 07, 2018 3:52 pm

Hmm, the need for a low profile card rather drastically limits the options, and I can tell you right now, you wont find a "proven" solution if by that you mean condor pilots using a low profile video card to feed 3 projectors.

You forgot to mention what videocard you're using now; maybe you can keep it. If it has displayport 1.2, you can use something like this:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/YQZH-EU-002-Mi ... B075S766ZP

To attach 2 HDMI displays to a single DP port. Similar devices exist with 3 HDMI ports, but the price goes up quickly. Do make sure your card supports at least DP 1.2 and not DP 1.1, otherwise these devices will act as splitters, showing the same image on each projector.

If you need a new card, just about any low profile card with 3 outputs should do, but you'll probably need at least one adapter, like from DP to HDMI. Those are cheap though. Checking in my local shop, there is only 1 low profile card:
https://www.alternate.be/html/product/1326924
It has 2x HDMI, 1x DVI and 1x DP. The DVI is digital only though (and I think most videocards you buy today will only do digital out), so you can not simply use a cheap passive adapter to go to VGA. But you should be able to use the DP with an DP to HDMI adapter to drive the third projector. Being all digital, small added advantage is that cable length isnt really an issue. Very long VGA cables dont tend to work well in my experience, certainly not at higher resolutions.

timbaeyens
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Re: Triple Monitor support?

Post by timbaeyens » Thu Jun 07, 2018 6:52 pm

wickid wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 3:28 pm
2 outputs are used to drive small screens behind the instrument panels. These have active miniDP to VGA connectors. We searched for HDMI capable screens but could only find VGA screens that where small enough to fit in the original ASK21 instrument panels.
What size do you need for these 2 small screens.
Can you share some picture of the instrument panel, and the whole setup?

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wickid
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Re: Triple Monitor support?

Post by wickid » Thu Jun 07, 2018 7:38 pm

I think one is 12 inch, the other 13.

Image
Front panel

Image\
I'm still working on integrating condor. We used to run Silentwings because of resolution restrictions in V1. Now I'm hard at work with V2. Still some software licenses to acquire for the screenwarping :lol:

Image
This is the whole setup, still runing Silentwings here.

Image
This is also still running silentwings. Here you can see our projection screen setup.
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Uros
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Re: Triple Monitor support?

Post by Uros » Thu Jun 07, 2018 8:26 pm

WOU!
Uros Bergant,
Condor Team

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wickid
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Re: Triple Monitor support?

Post by wickid » Thu Jun 07, 2018 8:42 pm

Uros wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 8:26 pm
WOU!
Haha, thank Uros! You don't know how happy I am with multimonitor capability in condor :D
PH-1504, KOE
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