Wave soaring

[soldano]

I am new to Condor 2 and gave it a try to wave soaring , and found it very interesting, as I could reach more than 9.000 meters height at Los Andes with a 100 Km West wind.-
I had never flew waves in real life and always have believed that lenticular clouds are at the top of the altitude you can reach, but in my case I flew well over them.-
Does it happens in real life ?
Thanks

[3P]

Maybe several layers is the answer?

[soldano]

No, there was only one lenticular layer, at no more than 5000 meters, no other layer were higher
I found it somewhat strange, as I heard that lenticulars are generated at the summit of each wave

[losnively]

Lennies can form at multiple layers, based on the moisture in each layer. How wind layers are generated, and how strongly they interact is complicated, and probably not well understood. On a day with lots of high level moisture, there can be stacks and stacks of lenticular clouds. There are also days when only one layer of the atmosphere has enough moisture, and the correct temperature gradient, for the moisture to condense into a lennie. So, yes, wave can extend far above the one layer of atmosphere that will generate a lenticular cloud.

Unfortunately, it's not uncommon to have one layer of lenticular cloud at the start of a flight, climb above it in clear air, and then have more moisture move in and completely obscure the ground. Getting down safely is not always possible, and, in that situation, always exciting, for a time, at least!

The takeaway is that climbing above lennies in Condor 2 is not unusual - it happens in RL as well.

[soldano]

Thanks that was a clear explanation.-
I wonder how exciting should be inside in a glider flying over the cloud layer without IFR flying instruments trying to get down with zero visibility

[enderw88]

Getting down is easy. Usually upside down and backwards...

One unusually good training aspect of Condor is to fly into clouds with basics instruments (Artificial horizon is cheating for this purpose). It is very realistic! It is very disorienting and will convince you too not do it in RL. You can get down safely with an aritificial horizon and judicious attention to airspeed.

[soldano]

Yes indeed, I had some experiences in real life flying gliders into clouds with just a turn and bank instrument, and is very tricky .- I found myself some times getting out of the cloud nose down vertically with brakes open.
Condor 2 is a good training tool, but it lacks the wind variation noise that helps to mantain speed and consequently attitude in that situations.-
I learned the hard way that it was useful to compensate for the speedometer normal lag or delay

[MrHerisson]

Getting down is easy. Usually upside down and backwards...

...... It is very disorienting and will convince you too not do it in RL.

So true

...but it lacks the wind variation noise that helps to mantain speed ...

not so true...maybe it lacks subtility but i often find myself noticing speed changes just by ear (ie when you hear no more wind it is time to panic)

[sin]

Does it happens in real life ?

Yeah!
Just now(a few days ago) 10 000 m in waves!
Over Elbrus
https://youtu.be/ZhqyYzL_qcA
This pilot Condor 2 Vitaliy Galaychuck (VG1) https://www.condor-club.eu/rank/0/;jses ... 19&class=0
and he 2-time champion of Russia in glider sport in real

[Filgueiras]

I never flew waves in real life, and I don't intend to.
But I did it in Condor2, while flying a badge task.
I'm now curious, is it so easy in RL than in simulator?

[Tailspin]

Getting down is easy. Usually upside down and backwards...

One unusually good training aspect of Condor is to fly into clouds with basics instruments (Artificial horizon is cheating for this purpose). It is very realistic! It is very disorienting and will convince you too not do it in RL. You can get down safely with an aritificial horizon and judicious attention to airspeed.

If your ship is approved for spins, they make for a safe way to get down without the risk of overspeed or over-G produced by a "death spiral." Of course, you have to be sure there is room under the cloud deck to recover.

[Paul_UK]

I did my cloud flying training recently. If it all goes wrong when in cloud then for recovery you brace the rudder pedals in the neutral position, brace the stick in the neutral position and apply full airbrakes. You then wait until you are out of cloud and hope you don't fall onto anything, like a tree or mountain I was assured that applying this with the glider in any attitude will work even though it may be a bit of a roller coaster ride down at first until things stabilize. The only time this method is a problem is if you get the glider into a spin, then the fun really begins

[wickid]

I did my cloud flying training recently. If it all goes wrong when in cloud then for recovery you brace the rudder pedals in the neutral position, brace the stick in the neutral position and apply full airbrakes. You then wait until you are out of cloud and hope you don't fall onto anything, like a tree or mountain I was assured that applying this with the glider in any attitude will work even though it may be a bit of a roller coaster ride down at first until things stabilize. The only time this method is a problem is if you get the glider into a spin, then the fun really begins

Not quite correct Paul. This may work in older types like the K7, K8 and ASK13 who have dive brakes (vertical dive possible without exceeding Vne.) Modern gliders certified to current CS22 regulations will exceed Vne in a vertical dive:

It must be shown that the sailplane with the airbrakes extended, will not exceed VNE in a dive at an angle to the horizon of:

(a) 45° when the sailplane is approved for cloud flying and/or aerobatics when certificated in the Aerobatic or Utility Category;

(b) in other cases (i) 30° (ii) less than 30° when a rate of descent of more than 30 m/s can be achieved.

Also extending the airbrakes lowers your maximum load factor (G-load).



But OT: I'm also wondering if real life wave is so easy. I'm trying to go wave flying this winter but until now I had to work when there were good wave conditions near here.

[Bre901]

But OT: I'm also wondering if real life wave is so easy. I'm trying to go wave flying this winter but until now I had to work when there were good wave conditions near here.

Condor wave is indeed easier than IRL, except maybe when it is possible (IRL) to fly directly into the wave : i.e. the inversion layer is very low and there are (almost) no rotor clouds

Otherwise (speaking from experience) it may happen that you don't find the "window" and you never reach the laminar part

[Paul_UK]

But OT: I'm also wondering if real life wave is so easy. I'm trying to go wave flying this winter but until now I had to work when there were good wave conditions near here.

Condor wave is indeed easier than IRL, except maybe when it is possible (IRL) to fly directly into the wave : i.e. the inversion layer is very low and there are (almost) no rotor clouds

Otherwise (speaking from experience) it may happen that you don't find the "window" and you never reach the laminar part

I think I got very lucky with my only experience of wave flying in RL. We launched from Aerodrome du Chevalet in Aspres-Sur-Buech, went straight onto the ridge behind the airfield which was working amazingly well. Once above the ridge line we noticed we could fly along and off the ridge but still climbing at a very strong rate. it Seems the wave frequency was just right that a big lump of it was right on the ridge line. The wind was very strong that day and we pretty much kept the airfield right below us all the way up to FL195 where airspace stopped us climbing.

I was lucky to also experience some nice rotor and rotor thermals further south by Serres. That was one hell of a ride up with lots of speed, the glider well cranked over and climbing off the vario Lots of Yeeehas were had in that one.

Other days (I was out at Serres for a week) making contact with the wave lift wasn't so easy. I wish I could afford to do that trip every year. There is something special about flying in the mountains.