First Impressions

[primitive_6]

Hello to everybody !

It's been a long time since we saw an update in the Condor community.
After the last news/updates it's time to say that yes...Condor 2 is official, but what's your impressions so far ?
Of course we didn't tried it yet, but in the fresh new website we can see a lot of information, pictures but also videos of the upcoming Condor !
Time to leave back the old forum and keep it for support proposes

So, what's your impressions for the new changes and what do you want to see in the future ?

[Tom]

My First impression when I joined the team way back when was omg, now a year later when I see the changes Uros and OXO and the rest of the team made, especially when you think everyone has a normal day job as well. I cant find my jaw after it hit the floor and kept going down.

[Skywalker220]

First impressions are amazing!
Seems you guys did a very good job and improved Condorsoaring in almost all areas!

Thank you very much!!!

I already love the Duo Discus and the great landscapes! Can't await to fly it by myself and start circling below these beautiful cu-clouds or start the first contest with up to 64 pilots!!

Beside all enthusiasm, I'm a bit disappointed on the sound effects. It seems all gliders have the same cockpit sound. (Windwhistl) Modern gliders like Duo or Antares aren't that loud in the cockpit. Also the click-sound of the handheld is weird. Haven't heard that before in any gliders.
So maybe after the most important things are done you could spend some work on sound improvements. I would really appreciate that.
And maybe another issue for a further update would the handheld be. Maybe you could add some more functions. Also a dream for the future would be to have XCSoar support.

And what I also would have been enjoyed is a Turbo (or even FES!) engine or a self-launching glider with correct simulation of the operating controls inside the cockpit. That would also be very helpful to demonstrate the usage of an engine to other club-mates or students.
Also within a high realistic scenery I would enjoy it going for a motor-powerd sightseeing tour to places I've never been before with a glider.

But I understand that developing software, especially simulations is not that easy and Condor is a glider simulation. (Not made for complex engine handlings simulations)

So I just wait to buy and download it and start new season 2018 with my first flight in Condor 2!

[primitive_6]

Well...i am quite impressive on what I have seen so far. New website is clear and simple with much more information compared to the older one.
I had a look also in the videos and the new information of the Condor 2.
I really like the idea that they keep it simple like the first one. However, one negative for me is that they didn't made any changes in the sound system of the simulator. I think they kept the original sounds without any modifications from the first version. Of course its a simulator and we don't care about these so much (for me only physics and features are important). However having a new simulator with old sound effects it gives you the feeling that it's still old (even if this is not true).
Hopefully in the next update they will work on this also. I am not expert, but i think it is not so difficult to do it.

[DiscusCSflyer]

Okay, we‘re now just looking at screenies and videos and development of v2 was not made by a full-time-development-team - however i still had some expectations (since many years ago).
I don‘t know if it is because of vast amount of experience with other software (-releases) and simulators in general, real life flying or with condor itself since over one decade. I am kind of disappointed with what i see right now.

What must be said, is that physics in condor were incredibly good right from the start. I never tried another simulator were gliding felt that realistic. Back in the days it was unbelievable to me and i had a ton of fun „playing“ Condor with my friends or alone. However, even years and years ago, the graphics and appearance were kind of meh and having every other type of game or simulation evolving and condor didnt, the joy using it kind of shrunk..
Flat cockpits, little to no reflections, low polygon plane models, vegetation and airport models.

I don‘t really see improvements to this. Even the sound (as if i left the small window on the canopy open) did not change, the cockpit with the old pda and the edgy pilot hand looks the same as before, clouds seem to have improved a bit (look like fsx 7,8 years ago with a glider addon i dont remember anymore).

As i said I know the team developed it as a private project while having other professions and i congratulate them on the upcoming release, but to me this is a new planepack and an updated version, it still has the edge over other software that condor had from the beginning but nothing really added to this.

[Tom]

Okay, we‘re now just looking at screenies and videos and development of v2 was not made by a full-time-development-team - however i still had some expectations (since many years ago).
I don‘t know if it is because of vast amount of experience with other software (-releases) and simulators in general, real life flying or with condor itself since over one decade. I am kind of disappointed with what i see right now.

What must be said, is that physics in condor were incredibly good right from the start. I never tried another simulator were gliding felt that realistic. Back in the days it was unbelievable to me and i had a ton of fun „playing“ Condor with my friends or alone. However, even years and years ago, the graphics and appearance were kind of meh and having every other type of game or simulation evolving and condor didnt, the joy using it kind of shrunk..
Flat cockpits, little to no reflections, low polygon plane models, vegetation and airport models.

I don‘t really see improvements to this. Even the sound (as if i left the small window on the canopy open) did not change, the cockpit with the old pda and the edgy pilot hand looks the same as before, clouds seem to have improved a bit (look like fsx 7,8 years ago with a glider addon i dont remember anymore).

As i said I know the team developed it as a private project while having other professions and i congratulate them on the upcoming release, but to me this is a new planepack and an updated version, it still has the edge over other software that condor had from the beginning but nothing really added to this.

Flat Cockpits? The panel and all instruments are 3d, there are reflections of pilot in instruments, reflections and shadows in the cockpit from sun and when you pass under clouds, canaopy reflection settings you can adjust. The physics and weather models all upgraded, hmm thats just a few of the changes.....

[DiscusCSflyer]

I was just telling by the videos. I’ll add a Screenshot of what i meant. I wasn’t speaking about the Instruments, which were by the way reflective / glossy with some free addons in v1. I meant that the panel itself has a very flat look, plus everything is very edgy.
Since Condor is a staggering simulation with regards to weather and physics, cockpit view is the view i spend 99% of the time in and i myself think it just looks a bit sad.

Edit: i was not able to upload a screenshot, i was refereing to the planes video in the „about“ section, first few seconds with the duo cockpit view shown.

[Cadfael]

I think that due to video quality and resolution is not possilbe to have some relevant impression. So maybe will be better wait to V2 and see it here. I personally love V2 very much (I have it more years as a member of team)

[Paul_UK]

I was just telling by the videos. I’ll add a Screenshot of what i meant. I wasn’t speaking about the Instruments, which were by the way reflective / glossy with some free addons in v1. I meant that the panel itself has a very flat look, plus everything is very edgy.
Since Condor is a staggering simulation with regards to weather and physics, cockpit view is the view i spend 99% of the time in and i myself think it just looks a bit sad.

Edit: i was not able to upload a screenshot, i was refereing to the planes video in the „about“ section, first few seconds with the duo cockpit view shown.

The videos have only been recorded in 720p, at least the ones on here that I have seen. The image quality on a full HD monitor will be better (1080p). I'm not sure what you mean by edgy? I think you may mean not smooth edges but that comes down to whatever antialiasing setting you have set in your graphics options. Very rarely do I let a game control this, I use Nvidia Inspector to set all of my graphics settings such as antialiasing and anistropic filtering, V-xync etc. Get this setup right and games / sims will always look amazing.

Last time I sat in a new glider the panel looked flat in shape to me. Pretty sure if you're that bothered you can use the re-paint kit to make the panel look more used / textured / tatty? Lighting also now plays a part of how a panel looks in V2, unlike in V1. The lighting and shadows caused by the lighting initially makes the panel look flatter. Watch the video more and around the 30 second mark whilst turning you see the effect lighting / shadows have and you then see the panel is not flat.

Personally a cockpit isn't the most pretty place to sit anyway, they are designed to be simplistic and functional. Most of your time you're sat in a real glider you spend the majority of it looking out doing a decent lookout. Granted not quite the same in the sim world. Focus for me though should be on quality instruments and they all look great!

[mada2000]

CG to the whole Condor Team. Well done
There was lot of expectation and guessings, which we chat among the national Condor teams and during the competitions. Like in real life - some are glad, some disapointed. Hope lots of wishes we will see in the next updates.
To me (but not only me) there is a one point not taken into account at the begining and in my opinion is crutial: re-connection during the task flying. It happen very often, that someone is disconnecting due to instantaneous internet troubles. I was sure it will be one of the main improvement topic in V2. Unfortunately it is not .
Do you think (Condor Team) it could be topic for resolving in the "nearest" ( ) future?

regards
Adam - AGO

[janjansen]

My impressions so far; I think its more a condor V1.5 than a V2. Especially if like me, you already flew V1 in (more than) HD resolution with AA using some directx hackery.

What I like so far:
- modestly improved graphics, real time shadows, better terrain resolution, planes themselves look really good.
- best flight and atmospheric physics models by far. Then again, V1 already had that, even after what, 15 years? But they improved on the atmospheric modelling and you notice it.
- New planes with again, extremely convincing flight characteristics.
- some bugs are being reported, but by and large, it seems to work pretty well out of the box for most people.
- everything that made V1 so good is still there. Best force feedback support, online race support, the physics modelling, well, everything that made us love V1 is still there.

Missed opportunities:
- VR, multi projection, 6 DoF support. Really, condor team should have seen this one coming, we've been begging for years. They put a cockpit simulator with 3 giant screens on the homepage, but they dont properly support 3 screens...
- Slightly underwhelming graphics overall. I dont mind too much, until someone links an aerofly video and I can only imagine how good condor would be with that graphics engine
- Clouds dont look better than before. Arguably worse, the Cu are all the shape of a basket ball, streets look nothing like cumulus streets, the cirrus clouds look like stretched giant pixels, the lenti's look okayish at best.

Still, Ive flown condor V1 since its release, and even being 15 or so years old, it provided me with hundreds if not thousands of hours of fun. I expect V2 to be the same. If that is not worth 60 euro, I dont know what is. I just hope that for V3 release in 2025, the one with the direct human brain interface, they team up with a third party graphics/terrain engine.

[suppafly]

Big props to the Condor - team !
Every aspect of the old version seems to be refined with more varietys added.
Personally for me realistic graphic is not that important as long as the physics feel right plus it wouldnt be nice
to have only a computer elite handeling this.
In RL The airspeed indicator can jump suddenly from 100kmh to 65kmh or so in turbulent conditions... it does not matter u can imagine it
whatever Its a very nice step forward for this simulation. It can help through rainy days etc...or some training.
I think its good that you just can not add every RL- flying aspects to a simulation.
Thanks + save & happy flying !!!

[Tom]

A lot of people have commented on the Graphics engine and compared it to other sims out there.

Whilst I agree some do look pretty amazing, the key things to remember are this sim has and always had an emphasis on multiplayer, when you throw anything upto 64 players in one race now, or even unlimited in freeflight you are handling more 3d models than the other sims, add to that the weather and flight models it would require much more powerful computers than v2 does even now.

It's about compromise giving the best overall performance with the most realistic flight and weather models, scenery that has realistic shading so you know where the shadows lift are and move with the time of day etc.

To me the realism and community aspect (multiplayer) beats eyecandy any day, whats more amazing and even having worked on V2 is the size of the team, I mean think about it one guy, not a team coded this! the rest of us made it look pretty either with the amazing new models, and trust me when I say you think the included ones are good, the new ones will blow your mind OXO, Ben etc, have done an amazing job on the new addons.

I know I'm biased in some ways because I helped in a small way with V2, but V1 kicked ass before, now its just got a whole lot better and the Dev's listen to you guys. But remember there isnt a big coding team behind this, just one brilliant one! And some of the best modellers that bring Great gliders that work in multiplayer as well without needing monster PC's o run everything on

[janjansen]

I mean think about it one guy, not a team coded this! .

It is impressive. I do tip my hat to him, I really do. But its also the problem, or at least, my greatest regret with condor, that this one person actually did everything, including so many things that are not at all unique to soaring, and have been done already by large teams who spent many man years on refining graphics engines with HDR rendering, volumetric lightmaps, water shaders, grass and foilage effects, fractal terrain generation, tessellation, 3D and VR, ..

Just imagine if condor team had been able to focus for 10 years on the things that make condor unique: the physics, flight models, the atmospheric models, the multiplayer/racing aspect, without having to spend much time to create a modern graphics engine, possibly even a terrain engine, instead use something on which hundreds of man years where spent. The graphics would look every bit as good as aerofly. Supporting linux or mac would be a breeze. Enabling VR would be little more than flipping a switch.

I dont know if there will ever be a condor V3. But if there will be, I hope the team reconsiders their NIH approach. Much of the strength of condor already comes from allowing third party content, like sceneries. I think they ought to take that further: make condor as a DCS module , license a graphics or even flight simulator engine like IL2; I dont know what the best approach would be or which game/graphics/terrain engines would offer enough flexibility. Maybe even turn it around, and license their flight and physics models so other flight sims with larger teams can integrate them? Opensource the engine, make money from the physics base module and plane packs ? I dont know, but reinventing everything with a 1 man team cant be the best way forward IMO.

/end rant

[devisddf]

In RL The airspeed indicator can jump suddenly from 100kmh to 65kmh or so in turbulent conditions... it does not matter u can imagine it

like this?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3URwCHhveQ&t=18s