Some newbie comments about Condor.

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Re: Some newbie comments about Condor.

Post by OXO » Thu Dec 08, 2011 11:51 am

We have done this discussion many times before. It's easy to prove vertical thermals in these modern times.

Simply download the IGC files from one of the gliding championships and overlay them in SeeYou or similar. You will then see that with gliders throughout the thermal column it is vertical.

This proof is incontrovertible and ends the discussion.
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Re: Some newbie comments about Condor.

Post by Olympia » Thu Dec 08, 2011 12:48 pm

What proof? Tell me where I can see a paper from a meteorologist that agrees with your assertion.

C E Wallington certainly didn't agree with you, and I'd believe him before you, any day.

When I did my Silver distance I only used three thermals. In each I climbed about 3000ft and drifted down wind towards goal by about two miles on each occasion. One of the thermals came from the Bow Brickhill brick works (I could tell by the burning smell) and the brickworks certainly wasn't moving. :)
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Re: Some newbie comments about Condor.

Post by OXO » Thu Dec 08, 2011 1:03 pm

Of course you drifted downwind! But that does not mean the column in a thermal is not vertical.

The whole thing drifts, and the bottom is not attached to the ground.

You brickworks example is not a classic thermal. It's a heatplume from a fixed ground source.
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Re: Some newbie comments about Condor.

Post by wickid » Thu Dec 08, 2011 1:08 pm

You're both right, but looking from a different perspective I think. A bubble of hot air (a thermal) rises vertically trought the air. So when several gliders are at slightly different altitudes they are more or less above each other. But when you look at their flightpaths you'll see that they are inclined from where they picked up the thermal. The entire vertical column of air is moving downwind, taking the gliders, smoke and burning smell with it.

Ofcourse it isn't perfectly vertical after a while because windspeeds differ at various altitudes.
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Re: Some newbie comments about Condor.

Post by OXO » Thu Dec 08, 2011 1:19 pm

No Wiek,

Thermals do not lean downwind. They lean downshear. This is a very small effect.


Please see:-

http://deltaklub.szm.sk/articles/a_thermal_en.htm
http://www.wetterklima.de/flug/soaring/ ... aufbau.htm
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Re: Some newbie comments about Condor.

Post by wickid » Thu Dec 08, 2011 1:23 pm

Yes I know, that is what I was trying to say :wink: . But when you look at the flightpath from a single glider it appears that it leans downwind. Although it was flying in the same vertical column of air all the time.
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Re: Some newbie comments about Condor.

Post by Freebird » Thu Dec 08, 2011 5:27 pm

When a thermal is triggered air starts rising, if it is not from some fixed source its base drifts with the wind hoovering up warm air from the boundary layer. You can see it if you are on the ground where or downwind of the point a thermal triggers. Pointed out to me by a well known gliding Met man.

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Re: Some newbie comments about Condor.

Post by Pablow » Fri Dec 16, 2011 12:57 pm

My first attempts at tug launch also presented the tug overrun, tried sticking the nose in the ground til tow plane gets airborne, still slewed/sailed past. airbrakes and flaps might help. Any recomendations, is this a problem in real glider take off or an algorythm glitch? No problem with winch take off.
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Re: Some newbie comments about Condor.

Post by Tima (TSD) » Fri Dec 16, 2011 1:08 pm

Just put trim full forward. This will help. And this is the case with real gliders - tug get aloft later then glider and you really need to push stick forward to avoid getting too high at the beginning of takeoff.
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Re: Some newbie comments about Condor.

Post by Pablow » Fri Dec 16, 2011 1:15 pm

Thank you!

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Re: Some newbie comments about Condor.

Post by OXO » Fri Dec 16, 2011 1:19 pm

Does this happen in freeflight, or multiplayer mode?
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Re: Some newbie comments about Condor.

Post by Moke » Tue Dec 20, 2011 6:37 pm

The tendency to over fly the tug happens during free flight for me. Have never tried multiplayer. Just returned once again from flying a ASK-21 on aerotow (RL) and can assure you that this tendency to overrun the tow plane does not exist any where near what is does in Condor simulation. Certainly something to address in future releases.

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Re: Some newbie comments about Condor.

Post by OXO » Tue Dec 20, 2011 9:45 pm

The problem is Mike, that we cannot replicate this problem. Nothing I try causes the glider to pass the towplane...

Also, before this thread, this difficulty has never been reported.
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Re: Some newbie comments about Condor.

Post by Freebird » Tue Dec 20, 2011 11:55 pm

I tried & I couldn't do it either.

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Re: Some newbie comments about Condor.

Post by simsoarer » Wed Dec 21, 2011 2:03 pm

The only way I can get the Glider to overtake the tug is to fly of to one side, it gives a sort of sling shot effect but you have to be a loooong way out of position for it to happen.

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